Rules Question

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By Guy W

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  1. Guy W

    Guy W
    Statesville, NC

    Playing the 16th at Stadium course this past Saturday my tee shot hit to the right of the green and bounced over underneath the stands at the tunnel area. I hit a second in case we didn't find the first and ended up about twenty feet from the hole. The first was found up underneath the stands so I played the second taking an unplayable for the first. I know that TIO comes into play but that's not the question. Thought of this on the flight home. Your tee ball goes into an area where you think it may be lost so you play a provisional. The provisional ball goes in the hole (a hole in three basically). When you get close to the green you find the original shot. What's the ruling? The second ball is holed. Or do you have to play the first since it was found? I think that it is the latter but would like a clarification. Thanks in advance for any answers.

  2. Abdon M

    Abdon M
    Northern California (because it's a big state)

    I'm certain that once the original ball has been found, you MUST play it and pick up the provisional. Of course, this is assuming that you found the original within 3 minutes of searching for it which means that if 3 minutes has passed since you started searching for the original, it is deemed to be a lost ball even if you rind it...if you know what I'm getting at (i.e. walk very slowly, but still keep pace).
  3. Abdon M

    Abdon M
    Northern California (because it's a big state)

    @Guy...check Rule 18.3c(3):

    "When the Original Ball is Found on the Course Outside Penalty Area Before the End of the Three Minute Search Time, the player must play the original ball as it lies.

    The player must not make any more strokes with the provisional ball which now a wrong ball (see Rule 6.3c)"
  4. Don O

    Don O
    Madison, WI

    Similar to anytime you hit a provisional, you must still play your first if found/identified and take appropriate relief if needed, be it unplayable or beyond white stakes. In the case of hitting the provisional for a second shot and subsequently finding the original, I’d need clarification from the Rules as well if the provisional is struck a second time prior to finding the first ball. I can only assume I’d need to play the first ball.

    Hitting into the same area but still under the stands, I took free relief from the TIO, no closer to the hole than the entry point. I didn’t hit a provisional as it wasn’t certain the ball entered the TIO or otherwise.

    I do have to admit when Phil M plays from up in the grandstands I don’t know what the options were for him
  5. Don O

    Don O
    Madison, WI

    Right, the 3 minute rule. If the first ball is deemed lost, only then would the second shot of the provisional occur. I would likely just be disappointed to be hitting 4 instead of 2.
  6. Chuck Z

    Chuck Z
    Mt Pleasant, SC

    Military
    Get relief from man made immovable object once you find. Too lazy to look up rule, if you find it within three minutes. Otherwise nice three. Not hole in one. Too tired to think on this one. With my big state friend. Enjoyed seeing all you guys. Those par fours beat me to death.
  7. Eric H

    Eric H
    Ridgway, PA

    but, Did you make the 20 footer?
  8. Guy W

    Guy W
    Statesville, NC

    Missed it low. Right pace wrong line.
  9. Charlie

    Charlie
    England

    late to the party as i missed this one- but:

    the provisional becomes a ball in play - if the first is lost - ie OOB or after 3 min search, or if you play it from a point closer to the hole (beyond the white stakes noted above is Out of Bounds- so you continue with the provisional) (rule 18.3c)

    you can hit a provisional multiple times and it still remains a provisional- providing non of the strokes are from closer than where the original is expected to be (rule 18.3c (1)

    if you hole the provisional - this becomes the ball in play when you pull it from the hole (USGA and R&A have clarified this as you can't play a stroke at a ball thats in the hole!)

    if you or someone else searches but finds the first before you lift the provisional from the hole - the 1st ball is in play and provisional must be abandoned.

    so in match play- run as fast as you can and pull the 2nd ball before your opponent manages to find your first in the thick stuff!
  10. Chuck Z

    Chuck Z
    Mt Pleasant, SC

    Military

    Charlie said:

    late to the party as i missed this one- but:

    the provisional becomes a ball in play - if the first is lost - ie OOB or after 3 min search, or if you play it from a point closer to the hole (beyond the white stakes noted above is Out of Bounds- so you continue with the provisional) (rule 18.3c)

    you can hit a provisional multiple times and it still remains a provisional- providing non of the strokes are from closer than where the original is expected to be (rule 18.3c (1)

    if you hole the provisional - this becomes the ball in play when you pull it from the hole (USGA and R&A have clarified this as you can't play a stroke at a ball thats in the hole!)

    if you or someone else searches but finds the first before you lift the provisional from the hole - the 1st ball is in play and provisional must be abandoned.

    so in match play- run as fast as you can and pull the 2nd ball before your opponent manages to find your first in the thick stuff!

    "you can hit a provisional multiple times and it still remains a provisional- providing non of the strokes are from closer than where the original is expected to be (rule 18.3c (1)"


    Had to read clarification on the above. Never thought someone would hit a provisional more that once. Good to know. Remember, you can continue to play your provisional ball until you reach the place where the original is likely to be. If you make a stroke at your provisional ball at or beyond that point, the provisional becomes the ball in play and the original is considered lost.

    A lot of verbiage on something already settled. The rule book is way to thick. I do carry a small version in my bag when playing tournaments. Of course a lot of courses have local rules, which are covered in the rule book.

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